Town Hall Meetings...Where's Grandma??
Only in Florida would one find a bunch of old people feuding and carrying on in such a hysterical way. Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh did their utmost best to scare the living daylights out of all sorts of old folk! I mean literally had these people shoving and pushing each other and one guy actually had his face punched!
All this in the name of "Healthcare Reform"...I wonder if the guy who got punched in the face even has healthcare? Ironic if he doesn't.
They stooped low enough to call our President a Nazi and had no issues with attempting to disrupt the meeting. I do believe that Fox news should be fined at the very least for inciting violence and mayhem...and that fine should hit them hard. But the very next best thing to do is boycott their advertizers (those that are left) and watch how quickly we get rid of that horrid, false "news" channel. They have done enough harm already and it's time they pay the price...We the People would be jailed if we tried to incite any riots outside of any townhall meetings and they should have some kind of consequences for their outrageous behavior...Glenn Beck has accused Obama of being a racist and hating white people...that man is beyond stupid and he is dangerous, because stupid people actually believe him. It's time to write or call your Congressmen and women and tell them that you SUPPORT the Healthcare Reform Bill and if that means Rush and Glenn get pissed off about it, GOOD! Whenever a Republican gets hysterical about something usually it's because they know they are on the losing end of an argument...they are so hysterical right now it tells me that Obama is moving in the right direction, and they are scared. Personally I don't think Grandma needs to worry about some "secret investigator" coming to her house and telling her "Hey ya ever thought about saving this country lots of money and offing yourself?" GET REAL PEOPLE!!!!!! Start thinking with your brains and not your emotions! GEEZE!!
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Only in Florida, Arkansas, Missouri, Arizona and everywhere else
that town hall meetings are being held, Sassys. The people behind these mobs who are refusing to let people ask questions about the health care bill are the insurance companies!! Who else? They are the ones behind Faux News, Rush Limbaugh and all the GOP and Blue Dog congressmen and women who are trying to prevent Americans from having affordable health insurance. They are spending $1.5 million a day - A DAY - on lobbying, on websites that give false and misleading information to citizens and on organizing these mobs at town halls. Not every person in those mobs is just a regular citizen. Those mobs are being run by paid organizers - paid by the insurance companies.
This is big business at its finest - pure capitalism at work. Isn't it a grand thing? They are doing everything in their power to shut down democratic dialogue because the more you know about what Obama and Congress are trying to do, the better it all sounds.
I'm thinking of immigrating to Sweden. I'll take Socialism over this capitalist corruption any day.
I Wanna go Too....PW
Sweeden looks good but so does Paris. Have you seen SICKO?
No, I'm not a big fan of Michael Moore ever since I found him to
be using the same tactics that lousy politicians use. He twists things to his own end and, frankly, I have no time for anything but the facts.
Yeah, Paris is looking pretty good, too. And there's another part of France I wouldn't mind living in - down south. There used to be a blogger on here names Hatsrus that lives in France in a rural area and she used to talk about the fields of lavendar and sunflowers where she lived. Man, that sounds really good about now.
When I was in France
I loved the gardens. People don't mow, they plant.
Think again!!
Rep. Kathy Castor and Sen. Russ Carnahan called out union thugs to rough up citizens who showed up to speak out against government-run medicine.
Rep. David Scott began screaming at a doctor who disagreed with him.
Rep. John Dingell got into an argument with an elderly man who brought his special needs son.
Speaker Nancy Pelosi claimed people who are revealing the details of HR 3200 are “carrying swastikas.”
Rep. Brian Baird refuses to even meet with his constituents to discuss the bill. He publicly referred to the senior citizens and families he’s supposed to represent as “Brown Shirts,” the infamous Nazi war criminals.
As the details of HR 3200 trickle out and public support for government-run medicine collapses, Democrats are doing everything they can to instigate chaos and bully the millions of Americans who don’t want government-run medicine.
Gee, you’d think there’s stuff in the Obama health care takeover Democrats don’t want people to hear about. Probably page 16 outlawing private health care, page 167 and others calling for new national taxes on people with “unacceptable” health care plans, or the sections calling for “end of life planning” for the elderly and sick. No wonder Democrats seem to be trying to turn town halls away from serious discussions of their bill and into WWE wrestling events.
Democrats are calling out the thugs because they want Americans to stop talking about their plan. That's the real truth!
TXKJUN, this one piece of information is so wrong that it
brings into question everything you have said.
"...page 16 outlawing private health care..."
There is not now and there has never been any plan to outlaw private health care. If a public option is offered it will be an option not a mandate - and there is no guarantee that a public option will even be offered. If you don't like the public option you can keep your own private insurance. Period.
And there has been no discussion of "...“unacceptable” health care plans..." by anybody. If you have private insurance and you are happy with it then you are welcome to keep it. You won't be penalized in any way for it.
I have no idea how the Unions got involved in this ridiculous little war the GOP is waging on the town hall meetings. However, they were not called out to rough up anyone. People were showing up at these meetings and refusing to let the Congressmen answer questions, refusing to let anyone else speak. The Unions apparently came in to help keep order to that people who had legitimate questions could ask those questions and get them answered.
Yes, some Congressmen have refused to have town hall meetings because of the disruptions that were started by GOP agitators at so many of the meetings. They were concerned about the possibility of violence and concerned that the meetings were not getting the information to the people who wanted it. Most of them are holding small, private meetings in their offices now instead of holding large meetings where organized disruptions can cause so much trouble and damage.
And claiming that Nancy Pelosi has leveled attacks on people who are "revealing the details of HR 3200" is just ridiculous. The details of HR 3200 are open to the public - have been for weeks. All you have to do is go read it.
Your accusation that Democrats don't want anyone to know what is in the plan is really the pot calling the kettle black. The insurance companies and the GOP have used every resource they can muster to keep Legislators from discussing this plan with their constituents. They have financed misinformation campaigns the likes of which I have never seen in this country where details of the plan are completely twisted and misrepresented. They are the ones that don't want the people of this country to know what Obama and Congress are trying to do.
Read the real HR 3200. Find out for yourself.
SEC. 102. PROTECTING THE
SEC. 102. PROTECTING THE CHOICE TO KEEP CURRENT
2 COVERAGE.
3 (a) GRANDFATHERED HEALTH INSURANCE COVERAGE DEFINED
4 Subject to the succeeding provisions of
5 this section, for purposes of 6establishing acceptable coverage under this division, the term ‘‘grandfathered health
7 insurance coverage’’ means individual health insurance
8 coverage that is offered and in force and effect before the
9 first day of Y1 if the following conditions are met:
10 (1) LIMITATION ON NEW ENROLLMENT.—
11 (A) IN GENERAL.—Except as provided in
12 this paragraph, the individual health
insurance
13 issuer offering such coverage does not enroll
14 any individual in such coverage if the first ef
15
fective date of coverage is on or after the first
16 day of Y1.
If you have coverage you can keep it, only if it meets certain guidelines. No company can enroll new members after Y1 so the people they have covered now will be it. No new business for them which means eventually they will be out of business. The hospitalization insurance business anyway.
No company can enroll new members under CURRENT CONDITIONS.
That means that new policies will have to conform to new laws. It does not mean that private companies will no longer be able to sell health insurance it just means they will have to sell it under new rules. New rules like not disallowing treatment for pre-existing conditions and cancelling people when they come down with an expensive illness.
Seriously, TXKJUN, I know you to be an intelligent and reasonable man. I know you to be honest and accepting and kind. And I think you have been listening to people that are deliberately twisting this stuff and they are people that you trust so you believe them. But they are only telling half-truths.
That's exactly as it should be Txkjun
All healthcare should have certain guidlines...hell had there been certain guidlines to begin with...let's say "No denials due to an insurance company not wanting to spend too much on "experimental" procedures" could have literally saved thousands of lives. My kid sister who was denied when she had breast cancer for what THEY deemed unnecessary, turned out to be something that is now considered quite common...I don't know about you but I don't like any insurance company "middle man" picking my procedures...I want what the doctor tells me is best for me to do. If they go out of business it will be because they are not doing the job they are supposed to do. They are to use the millions of dollars WE give them to help us get the CORRECT healthcare that WE have painstakingly paid for.
Do you still have...
union thugs,John?
In searching for the speech where Pelosi supposedly accused
people of "revealing details of HR 3200" and carry swastikas I found this - pretty much a copy and paste of what you have posted. This is not fact. This is a letter concocted by a hard-right-wing organization with misleading, twisted and completely false statements intended to incite and enrage conservatives.
I did not find anywhere that Pelosi accused people of "revealing details of HR 3200". What I found was a statement by Pelosi that people disrupting the town hall meetings were carrying swastikas - and there are pictures all over the Internet and the television of them. In that same statement she made a comment about Barney Frank "revealing" what HR 3200 meant to him.
I also found an article at The Atlantic that stated: "AFL-CIO President John Sweeney called on affiliate unions to launch a 30-day campaign of activism in support of health care reform--and, perhaps most significantly, to turn out union members to town-hall meetings."
And I found an article in the Tampa Bay Online stating that Rep. Castor's town hall meeting was organized by Rep. Reed and Unions that support Obama.
I did not find one single news report where evidence that Union thugs were asked to come out and beat anyone up or scare anyone off.
Yes Txkjun this is true however
these people reacted to the ugly protesters...they didn't just suddenly lose their minds and start shouting like mad men...nope they were confronted by violence to begin with! Outlawing "private healthcare"? I am trying to understand why you are not reading between the lines? We all know that just because it is written does not mean it will be implemented in the manner you are suggesting...like the "end of life planning" It is PLANNING...meaning one can at least think about what one may CHOOSE to do when one is terminally ill. People with unacceptable healthcare can mean many things...and there are literally thousands of people that are on lousy plans that do nothing for them except DENY them when they are ill...hell the one thing they don't deny ever is the MONEY they steal! And the Dems are NOT worried that Americans will "read the plan" they are HOPING they will read it so they can pass it...otherwise YOU would NOT have been able to read it yourself. They have made it available for anyone to read! They WANT you to read it and they want to have open discussions about it without the Limbaugh, Palin and Beck LIES one can actually see what the truth is...and unlike the bible one cannot change it and twist it to what they choose it to mean. And THAT is the plain truth.
I'm Glad you Wrote This Sassys
I have NEVER seen things llike this. There was LOTS and LOTS of crap Bush shoved down our throats and we protested by writing about it. I am appalled at the childish behavior of the republican party. Even when the Democrats had a majority they acted civilly. The republicans are out of control angry over something that is intended to help the majority of people not just a few elite. I have to hand it to Bush he really knew how to play people by wording things that made the poor suckers believe he was doing something for them. Obama is actually doing something for the middle class and the republicans are pitching a screaming fit and practically committing tyranny over it.
They are also purposely lying Ms Zola
because this Bill is aimed at the middle class but it ALSO gives the people who need it the most...the desperately poor, something better than medicaid and they will get to choose whom they see for a change. This bill scares people because they are not ready to see the ugliest of truths and that is that Bush and co have truly been punishing the poor simply for being poor and what better way than to give them the crappiest healthcare out there? Not only that but the poorest amongst us tend to have no alternative but to take their sick kids to the E.R everytime they get a cold because no doctors take Medicaid in their area...it's a very broken system and something does need to be done about it.
I heard her say it!!
And claiming that Nancy Pelosi has leveled attacks on people who are "revealing the details of HR 3200" is just ridiculous.
I heard her say it!! I saw her say it!!
Plain as day!!
I have read the bill. The PDF version from the GPO. I have gone back to a few specific sections and reread it.
If you are for this bill. Good for you. If you are opposed to this bill. Good for you.
I personally do not support it.
I hate both Democrats and Republicans. Both are stirring the pot on this one!!
Then she has clearly lost her mind, TXKJUN. And I'm sorry.
I'm not a big fan of Pelosi's but I did think she was sane enough to know that anybody who wants to can find out the detals of that bill.
But frankly, you appear to be doing some pot-stirring of your own.
No not really
Like I said if you are for the bill. Good.
If you're against it. Good.
I for one am against it.
I just get tired of hearing that the dems did this or the repubs did that when they are both a bunch of power hungry idiots.
Bring back the Whigs and the Democratic-Republican parties!!
GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!
That particular part of the bill was written by
none other then Johnny Izakson from Georgia...and the fact is that it is a part of the Healthcare Reform bill but that does not mean that they are sending out "death squads" looking to kill anyones grandma...it is simply giving people a DECENT choice. That's what it should be. I like the idea that if God forbid I should suddenly become terminally ill, rather than sit by and suffer a painful death, I have the choice to seek a quick end that is also dignified.
No, Sassys, that part of the bill does not give you a choice for
a quick end. Please, please, PLEASE!!!! That's not what it is about in any way, shape or form! It gives you a choice about whether you want to be kept alive on machines - think Terry Shiavo, it gives you a choice about rescusitation efforts if your heart should stop. It does not give you a choice for a quick end.
Well hell PW that already exists
now...it's called a DNR...Do Not Resusitate...And it should be common knowledge for everyone...shit that has been around for ages. So maybe they should give us that choice...but I get what you are saying.
Yes, Sassys. But so many people do not know about it
because they can't afford to pay for the consultation and the doctors don't tell them - maybe because they want them to pay for the consultation. That's another reason that this clause is such a good thing. I have a DNR. Hell, if I'm gone just let me go. If you rescusitate me I'll just have to pay the fucking hospital bill.
Pay the bill PW?
Nope I would tell them to go and "collect" it from the insurance companies...bastards!
LOL!! As if, Sassys.
My current health insurance has found a way to deny every fucking claim I've made. I've only made 2 cause I just could not afford to get hit with any more bills, but I figure that's enough to show just what kind of rip off MFs they are.
All the more reason to stick it to them PW
just insist and tell them that that's what you have already paid for! Screw them! GRRRRRRRR. I hate insurance companies...and life insurance is a waste of good money...hell just ask the experts..they will tell you that unless you are seeing the end, and you have kids etc. buying life insurance is pointless. There are people out there that literally start buying life insurance in their early twenties...ridiculous.
Unfortunately, Sassys, you either accept what they tell you or
they cancel you. Period - no arguments. I fought for over 4 months to get them to pay for 2 office visits and 3 tests. I have to have this insurance in case I get really sick. Or if I break a leg or fall down stairs or whatever. I can't afford to be cancelled and they know it. That's why this legislation is so fucking important and that's why I REFUSE to listen to lies. I will fight back against the lies until they stop telling them!!!!!
Me too PW
I too will out the lies and liars...I am doing this for myself but also for my kids...they deserve the best in healthcare this country has to offer. Limbaugh's kids need not worry about this issue, neither do the kids of La Palin so they don't deem it an important issue...UGH!
It's greed and selfishness at it's core.
Now wait a minute
There's nothing wrong with buying life insurance!! I was covered by SGLI in the Army and I bought my first policy at 21 when I got out of the service. If I kick before the Bubba he will get a little over $650,000.00. But don't tell him that, the little shit might try to knock me off. LOL
I have policies for my girls too. They are the beneficiaries on two policies I bought in the early 80's. I did this for my kids. Get it while you're young it's a lot cheaper!!
I guess I have been lucky
John Hancock paid for my 2 daughters births, and paid for sinus surgery for my ex wife. Blue Cross/Blue Choice paid for 3 hospitalizations for my son and a knee surgery for me. I have never been denied a claim. I don't know anyone with decent insurance that has ever been denied either. Well until now. Who is your insurance company?? I used to see small signs plastered all over Austin that a certain insurance company does not pay claims. Can't remember which one it was.
Ok girls ROAD TRIP!!!!!!
Lets all go to France!! Only problem I have with France is it tends to be full of French people:( French people get very protective of their loverly language...I speak French and I have witnessed the difference between the way I was treated and the way a girlfriend that did not speak French was treated, as a matter of fact she was from Texas and she had a very pronounced drawl...so she was not treated with any respect by the French...I used to get into huge arguments with waiters etc. it drove me crazy!! Europe is a pretty cool place but it does depend on where one goes big time:)
Road trip it is, Sassys!
And to hell with all those uppity French people. I shall learn to say "Hi, ya'll" in French and they can kiss my bodacious bootay if they don't like it. LOLOL!!!
LOL PW have Bon Bons will travel?
I would prefer to go to Spain! And they DO have national Healthcare for all of their citizens...as does any decent country! I truly do not understand the resistance the GOP is putting up...when this bill is passed and lets say about 10 years down the road, if it works out well guess who will be the first to say it was their idea?
I think I will change the GOP logo to GLOP...just cause it sounds funny to say...GLOP,GLOP,GLOP!! "Today in the news the GLOP has done it again...they claim to have found Alaska right outside Sarah Palins kitchen window...stay tuned while Rush Limbaugh deciphers exactly what the GLOP will do with that information"
ROFLMBAO!!!!!
That's Rolling on Floor Laughing My BODACIOUS Ass Off!!!!!
"...found Alaska right outside Sarah Palins kitchen window..." God help me, I can't breathe I'm laughing so hard!!!! Thank god my boss is in a meeting. LOLOLOL!!!
LOL PW ya know?
It's sometimes too easy...and they wouldn't get this comment either :>
Count Me In....Sassys
Spain or France....I lkie the weather.....better than Sweden's weather.....I do speak some French and LOVED the people and the country.....I got lost in Barcelona and had to find French speaking people to help me find my way back to the hotel.....Not too many people spoke English....But......I bet you know some really neat places in Spain.....Mostly, all I saw was Barcelona....we rented a car and drove from Spain through France to Switzerland......I could go back in a heartbeat!!!11
Well of COURSE Ms Zola!!
I meant that comment to include you! I absolutely LOVE Barcelona...But I also want to go to the Alhambra and oh so many cool ass places...What I REALLY want to do is go Castle hopping...that is my idea of a great time...ooooh and also I miss seeing real live Flamenco!! LETS DO IT and then we COULD BLOG about it on the road! We could call it SassZolPuss travels through Spain! YAY!
LOL .....Sassys :)
We gotta go......I can just imagine the flamenco dancers......what's the first part of that word???? Flame???? All those handsome Spanish men in their tight dancing pants......what did you say our traveling name is???? I can hardly think straight.....visions of Flamenco dancers keep passing through my head.......
Sassys came up with SassZolPuss but I think we should call
ourselves Sassypuszola! sassy-puss-zola with the s and the z blending in together and the emphasis on the la at the end - sounds exotic to me. Si, Senor, we are the Sassypuszola, come to grace your establishment and bring joy to you and your patrons. Now bring on the Flamencos!!!
LOL!!!
I like your version better PW
LOL we could even throw in an LA and make it SassypussLAzola:)Sounds like a desert.."I'll have the Sassypusslazola please"
Love it!!!!
The three of us make a fantastic team. My bags are packed - I'm ready!!!
How about
FLAME ENCOS? When do we leave?
When I win the Lotto!!
Lets see....I have a ticket for tonight and WHEN I win I shall buy all the tickets etc...leave it in my hands ladies...we will see Spain in 2020...if it's still there:(
Or IF
I am still here......or care about the Flamenco Dancers while lounging in the nursing home......still....I may have a smile on my face just thinking about those Spaniards in their tight Flamenco pants.....sighs......2020????
A lot of controversy for a change to...
socialised healthcare we have had in NZ, Britain and Scandinavia for 60 odd years. It is not socialism. NZ, Australia and the Uk have state education that is paid for out of taxes too. What is different by having healthcare subsidied by taxes? What I am talking about is basically free emergency access to public hospitals paid for out of taxes, waiting lists(bit of a bummer some times)for non-urgent hospital treatment. You have the choice for the latter by having private insurance. We have a state owned accident insurance scheme which is paid for out of levies from employers, employees and motorists. It is called ACC. It covers everybody in the country, even Americans on holiday or fleeing from Barack Obama LOL. All health costs are paid for, and residents can get 80% of income paid for.
Thank you for adding a voice of reason, Hutts.
People are going nuts over the misinformation and lies that the insurance companies are putting out. The big insurance companies reap billions of dollars from the U.S. system and they don't want to lost that. I don't blame them for not wanting to lose that but I do blame them for putting out the lies.
It is not just the Insurance Companies PW
It is also fueled by the likes of Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck, Rush Limppaw etc.... The far right are eating this shit up and they will try to blame Obama for it all...they SO disgust me!
Who do you think is PAYING Palin, Beck and Limbaugh?
The insurance companies are spending $1.5 million dollars a day - A Day on this shit. And the Republicans have their hands out, too. Every single Republican in Congress is on the payroll of the insurance companies through donations to their campaign funds. That has been clearly documented and published and people still believe what these crooked bastards tell them.
You Know What....PW?
This makes me ill. It is what's wrong with this country. Nothing and no one is about the good for the many, but who can get rich by getting elected to Congress. I know you don't like Micheal Moore, but he did point out all the Congressmen/women who ended up going to work for the Pharm Co. making mega bucks after they pushed through the Bush Pahrm Bill for seniors. He makes a good point....they may love THEIR mothers....just....not OURS!
I agree Ms. Zola.
And I also agree that Michael Moore makes some very good and valuable points. But since I can't always trust his facts, I just don't watch his stuff. I know that sounds strange - I don't think he's wrong about these things, I just don't like the methods he sometimes uses. See, I get very angry when the Republicans do it and so does every non-Republican out there. So, I think we have to hold the people who are taking our side to a higher standard.
See Hutts!! This to me makes sense!
This is how a civilized country should take care of all it's citizens! The Republicans do not want anything to change because they have all the money and simply put they don't want to spend it on taxes...what they don't want us to know is that the only people that would be taxed at all would have to make $350,000 a year. Not too many people make that amount of money except the stinking rich...it shows their real motive in the lies and it shows yet another example of their greed.
Suppose this bill passes
And you still can't afford the (maybe) cheaper cost of a policy so decide to remain uninsured. Title IV Subtitle A Part 1 Section 401 will tax you for not having acceptable care. It's right there on page 167 and continued on page 168.
Page 167 Line 18
SEC. 59B. TAX ON INDIVIDUALS WITHOUT ACCEPTABLE HEALTH CARE COVERAGE.
(a)TAX IMPOSED.--In the case of any individual who does not meet the requirements of subsection(d)at any time during the taxable year, there is hereby imposed a tax equal to 2.5 percent of the excess of
(1)the taxpayer's modified adjusted gross income for the taxable year, over
(2) the amount of gross income specified in section 6012(a)(1) with respect to the taxpayer.
Page 168 Line 6
(1) TAX LIMITED TO AVERAGE PREMIUM.--
(A)IN GENERAL.--The tax imposed under subsection (a) with respect to any taxpayer
for any taxable year shall not exceed the applicable national average premium for such a taxable year.